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The trouble with forgiveness
Last post 09-06-2009 1:16 PM by Ricky. 22 replies.
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07-15-2009 6:55 AM
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ZenGirl


- Joined on 07-15-2009
- Posts 1
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The trouble with forgiveness
I just read an excellent post on the healing power of forgiveness. In it the author discussed the fact that many people are challenged by the idea of forgiveness because it seems to imply condoning the offense. This is something I have struggled with myself, particularly in terms of abusive interactions in close interpersonal relationships. While I completely understand and accept that forgiveness is healthy for =me=, I struggle with actually letting go and truly entering a space of forgiveness. As I thought about this more I realized that in the cases where I have the most difficulty forgiving, it is because I still fear further abuse (in my particular case emotional/verbal) from individuals with whom I am unable to completely sever relationships. In some way it feels as though completely forgiving the past abuse would mean letting my guard down (e.g., "giving as you gave before the offense"), which seemingly opens the door for future abuse (or at a minimum leaves me less protected against it). I am interested to know if anyone has encountered something similar either in clients or themselves and found a way to overcome that block. Intellectually I completely understand the power of forgiveness in healing. I am at a place where I want and need to heal. However, this issue keeps arising, and I have not yet found a way on my own to feel =safe= in forgiving.
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Mildred



- Joined on 08-20-2007
- Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
- Posts 474
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi ZenGirl, Forgiveness can be difficult. I found a good article by Fred Luskin that he has given me permission to post on my site. Nine Steps to forgiveness link Combining these 9 steps with EFT provide a very powerful process. Treating the trauma of your experience makes you more resistant to re-experiencing the trauma now. Many of our traumas were inflicted when we were helpless children, unable to defend ourselves or get away from our abusers. As adults we are more resourceful. We can leave the room, or in the case of physical assault, we can take legal action. We can hang up the phone. We can tune out and know that the abuse being hurled our way is more about the insecurities of the abuser than it is about us. I have helped people get past amazingly hurtful experiences with EFT. A lot of this is in the re-framing of the situation. Mildred
Mildred Thill, EFT-ADV, EFT Cert-I Brain Gym Instructor/Practitioner Anxiety Forum Co-Moderator www.emofree.ca Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Please visit my blog: http://eftedmonton.wordpress.com
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Suzanne



- Joined on 08-22-2007
- Cape Town, South Africa
- Posts 614
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi ZenGirl, You ask about similar encounters in clients. I have two to share, which are representative of many: - One client who was still very much in danger. This client did forgive (previous to meeting me), but did so without reducing contact with the abuser to a minimum. I worked with the client on breaking dependence on the abuser, which gave the client more independence and more freedom.
- One client who was no longer in any danger (the abuser had passed away) but could not forgive. We worked on the following:
- It is not really up to us to forgive. Only God/the Universe can have the final say in forgiveness.
- Therefore there is no longer a burden on us to forgive. This burden is too great, and we hand it over to God/the Universe.
- What we can go is let go of the anger and blame. We must keep our natural caution, and EFT will never take that away, EFT will keep us safe. And also even though this blame is a witness to what happened, we now choose to be truly free of it, for our own happiness. Letting go of anger/blame does not negate what happened or negate that it was wrong. It only frees our system from this yukky energy.
That did it, and the client now feels a lot lighter. All the above was put in "Even though.." statements, and we tapped on very specific events. I hope this helps.
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orenda



- Joined on 05-01-2008
- Clinton, Utah
- Posts 48
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi ZenGirl, I've had a lot of difficulty with forgiveness, too. But I've learned that what forgiveness and clearing the emotions around the incidents allows me to do is to understand the relationship and issues from a new perspective. I can see how things started because of the beliefs about self that the abuser and I had. Understanding this helps me tremendously to let go of any anger at the abuser and at myself for not being able to stop it at the time. Then I discovered a serendipitous effect-I felt empowered. When I thought of the person again, I knew that I was able to stand up to them and that I would have my wits about me, be able to see what was happening, and prevent it from happening again. Instead of feeling like I had to allow this person to do whatever they wanted and then have to choose to walk away or end the relationship, I felt my energy around the relationship change. I began to feel as if I was closing the door to any further abuse because I was no longer in a space of thinking that it was okay to treat me in that way. The other person would now have to choose something else or not have a relationship with me. This has played out nicely, if not entirely smoothly, in one relationship, but I haven't talked to the other person I had an abusive relationship with in many years and have yet to see how I would actually react if I saw them again. It's an ongoing process because the beliefs about myself that allowed the abusive behavior from others are deep-seated and have required a lot of digging to uncover. I still haven't gotten to all of them, but I work on it whenever I see them come up. Maybe instead of feeling as if you're letting your guard down, you can begin to feel as if you're putting up a new guard-the guard of "it's not okay to treat me like this and I don't accept it anymore". Shift the energy and watch things magically change!
We shall never cease in our explorations, and the end of all our exploring shall be to arrive at the place where we began and know it for the first time. T. S. Eliot
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Ingrid


- Joined on 08-23-2007
- NH
- Posts 638
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi ZenGirl,
this is a great question! Thank you for posting this.
With my Veterans, forgiveness is cruicial.
I belive that what is called "PTSD" by mental health professionals is actually a result of being exposed to situations that cannot be forgiven. Others describe it as "betrayal of that which is right".
This is very traumatic and further reaching than most people can imagine.
I tell my vets that we "don't judge, condone or excuse what happened, we help heal what happened".
Forgiveness does not come from condoning or excusing. The door can be opened by understanding things in the context of what truly happened. Many issues seem unforgivable partially because they are taken out of the context of where the people involved where at at the time. Of course, no matter what the circumstances, we are always responsible for our actions.
Even though there are many issues that cannot be excused, they can be understood in the context of which they happened. Forgiveness can then mean letting them go simply because they happened a long time ago, and the only reason we are still suffering from them is because we are still emotionally attached and are keeping them alive. If we released the suffering and blame, we could use that energy for something else.
A part of the forgiveness tapping is always, to find a better way of honoring what truly happened. Forgiveness allows for us to teach others about what happened to us and what people can do to others. It allows to hold a dead person's honor even higher, to tell the story of outrageous issues and events so that others can learn from them.
We deserve to not suffer from our past. We deserve to live with whatever happened in a way we choose, and find a better way of dealing with whatever life and our circumstances have thrown at us.
In this sense, forgiveness can mean releasing our need to attachment to the past, and finding a new and better way of dealing with it, that truly works for us.
I am looking forward to learninng more about how others see this! Love
Ingrid
Ingrid Dinter, EFT ADV. NH New Hampshire EFT Trauma/PTSD Forum Co-Moderator EFT Professionals Forum Co-Moderator Release the past, create your future with EFT www.eftcoach.us Helping Veterans and their families heal with EFT www.eft4vets.comPlease visit my blog: www.eftforvets.com
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vernpeace


- Joined on 11-22-2008
- Posts 170
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
hi ZGirl, forgiveness...is...one...of...the...elemental... energies/emotions...along...with...courage...faith... and...acceptance...working...in...harmony...with...each ...other...greating...gratitude...the...one...harmonious ...whole...when...we...lose...our...appreciation...for... what...is...and...faith...becomes...fear...courage...turns ...to...shame...acceptance...denial...and...the...ability... to...forgive...must...also...find...its...self...lost...also ...so...where...to...begin...acceptance...faith...courage... forgiveness...leads...you...back...to...gratitude...strange however...true! peace&love...vern
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bodhileaf



- Joined on 08-20-2007
- UK
- Posts 737
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
For me, forgiveness comes when we can shine the light of love into the dark places of fear, guilt, shame that we carry within us and is a release of judgment which is what, as Ingrid says, keeps us attached to the emotional energy. Rather than forgiveness, I like the energy that comes from acknowledging and accepting the part I played and that others played in co-creating the events that happened. Empowerment comes from owning our responsibility for what we create - even when we felt we were small, innocent, helpless - for an altogether higher purpose. When I find myself getting stuck in victimhood or swallowed up in guilt, shame and fear, I visualise myself standing to one side of all the emotional energy and breathing light and love into it, embracing it and allowing it to be what it is - tapping without words. Forgiveness gets difficult when we are still resisting the emotions and as EFT so brilliantly demonstrates, everything works through acceptance. There is no more honourable and courageous and loving work than to allow those energies to release through us and I honour all who are working at this profound level. blessings Marian
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Namaste



- Joined on 02-21-2008
- Ireland
- Posts 343
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi Zengirl,
One of the best definitions I've heard about forgiveness that really resonates with me is from Deepak Chopra in the book Ageless Body, Timeless Mind:
Forgiveness of others comes only when you can release your own hurt. The more complete your release, the more sincere the forgiveness.
EFT is one of the best tools I've found to help us release and dissolve all our hurt and pain.
Noreen.
Noreen Barron M.A. EFTCert-I Co-Moderator Chronic Diseases and Physical Conditions http://energyandintention.comEFT BlogA4 EFT Short Cut ProcedureYou are searching the world for treasure, but the real treasure is yourself - Rumi
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Ingrid


- Joined on 08-23-2007
- NH
- Posts 638
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi Noreen,
thank you for that. Yes, I agree: Forgiveness is NOT about condoning what happened, it is about releasing our response to it. Forgiveness is a service and gift we give ourselves.
The more we can let go of our need to respond with the initial feelings of fear, despair, anger,...the more we realize that we can actually find more powerful ways of moving forward, not despite of what happened to us, but because of it, including it into our life experience in powerful ways that make us even more unique, special and knowledgable.
Therefore, healing without forgiveness is not possible.
Thank you so much for this wonderful conversation!
love
Ingrid
Ingrid Dinter, EFT ADV. NH New Hampshire EFT Trauma/PTSD Forum Co-Moderator EFT Professionals Forum Co-Moderator Release the past, create your future with EFT www.eftcoach.us Helping Veterans and their families heal with EFT www.eft4vets.comPlease visit my blog: www.eftforvets.com
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Namaste



- Joined on 02-21-2008
- Ireland
- Posts 343
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Thanks Ingrid, this is a great conversation ;-)
I really feel when we release our hurt and give ourselves permission to do that, the state of mind that comes afterwards naturally and not in a forced way is forgiveness, i.e. an acceptance of all that went on and not a condoning as you say. If we 'see' forgiveness as a state of mind that gives us peace rather than as something we have to 'do', we feel a lot better and it takes the pressure off!
Love, Noreen.
Noreen Barron M.A. EFTCert-I Co-Moderator Chronic Diseases and Physical Conditions http://energyandintention.comEFT BlogA4 EFT Short Cut ProcedureYou are searching the world for treasure, but the real treasure is yourself - Rumi
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Fabienne



- Joined on 08-20-2007
- Crowborough UK
- Posts 328
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi Everyone,
An image or metaphore that has been powerful for me is to imagine the grievance like a hook in the back (or wherever you feel it). Forgiveness is about releasing the hook.
It gives one so much freedom.
Thank you,
Fabienne
Fabienne Brilland Chronic Diseases and Physical Conditions Co-Moderator EFT Level 3
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creative1


- Joined on 07-31-2009
- Posts 13
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
I personally believe that it isn't necessary to forgive in order to heal from abuse. At least Two sources, The Survivor to Thriver Manual, and The Courage to Heal, both state that it's not. My previous therapist said it is not. Google the issue and you'll find more professionals who point this out as well. Though I am using EFT on myself, and have done a lot of forgiving, I don't think it's truthful or fair to place such a high value on forgiveness as crucial to healing. To be 'allowed' to heal whether you forgive or not seems to me to be key to emotional freedom. am disappointed, actually, that EFT is supposed to involve forgiveness. Many people cannot forgive for many reasons. I don't think they should be told they can't heal because of this.It's placing a limitation on people who have already had limitations forced on them. I'm not at all saying it's okay to seek revenge or retribution. Forgiveness is an ideal and can be worth working toward. Healing from abuse is real work. Someone who has done the work to heal from abuse should not be told they aren't healed because they can't or won't forgive. They weren't the abusers. I don't believe that the 'requirement' of forgiveness should be maintained in the practice of EFT.
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Mildred



- Joined on 08-20-2007
- Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
- Posts 474
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Hi creative1, I think if you compare those who say forgiveness is necessary with those who say it is not, you will find a different definition of forgiveness. The EFT definition is the one that Suzanne and Ingrid describe. Please read their postings carefully and you will see that forgiveness is not about putting yourself back in a vulnerable position with the person who hurt you. It is not about saying that what they did to you was okay. It is about letting go of the hold that their actions still have on you. It is about healing. It is about moving forward. It is about letting go of the hurt, the pain and the trauma that is long past. Mildred
Mildred Thill, EFT-ADV, EFT Cert-I Brain Gym Instructor/Practitioner Anxiety Forum Co-Moderator www.emofree.ca Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Please visit my blog: http://eftedmonton.wordpress.com
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creative1


- Joined on 07-31-2009
- Posts 13
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Mildred Thanks for your reply. I understand exactly what you're saying. And that's the reason I personally try to forgive. I understand the reasons and strong motivation to forgive. But, my point is that some people don't forgive. And I see them as going on doing healing anyway. I'm obviously not talking about EFT. Maybe we could agree to disagree peacefully...I hope. Thanks again!
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Gill Wightman



- Joined on 08-21-2007
- Fife, Scotland
- Posts 1,034
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Re: The trouble with forgiveness
Mildred, this is such a great distinction and one we must be clear about. It really is about understanding the definition of forgiveness. However I do understand Creative's perspective here, particularly at the start of any trauma work. The definition I found when searching for one is Forgiveness is typically defined as the process of concluding resentment, indignation or anger as a result of a perceived offense, difference or mistake, and ceasing to demand punishment or restitution. So
therefore yes, forgiveness is necessary for healing. The most
important place where forgiveness is needed however in childhood trauma
is of self first and foremost. I have certainly found that to be true
of myself. Our ability to to punish ourselves and become our own abuser is the most harmful outcome
of trauma, and this arises for all sorts of reasons. One of my favourite phrases I use is "forgiveness is the gift I give myself" because it really is. However
I do believe that it could be possible to push for it too fast in EFT sometimes and I can
agree with the points made. Often the focus is on forgiveness as an
ought even, when it is in my experience a natural conclusion of healing
which comes through allowance of the feelings of outrage, resentment,
hurt, need for revenge etc to be expressed freely and of course tapped
on without judgement and with compassion. Then and only then can we
come into balance. So therefore we can say its NOT OK, it never will be OK, I will never understand how it happened, but I am willing to change my response to the events I cannot change. I have certainly had the experience with EFT and some therapists who were unwilling to let me express myself as I needed to. This has also been the experience of more than a few of my clients. It takes real courage as a therapist to work with childhood trauma. It is of interest to me how people find they
have forgiven naturally, seeing a bigger picture at the end of a round
of expressive, venting, going for it tapping, perhaps acknowledging mental illness or a chain of trauma through the ages, as a reason, but that still does not make the persons 'best' a good or acceptable best even with their experiences in life what happened was their best. Choices and reframes
should be very gently introduced at the right time and it takes alot of
skill to get that right. Trauma therapists need to be
comfortable with the underbelly of human emotion and be willing to
allow its expression, not just for the sake of expressing it, there is
always an intention for healing or the person wouldn't be tapping in
the first place, but there can be big conflicts arise with a part wanting to let go and a part fighting to hold on to the anger as its the only weapon they have left. I do have to address this utter fear of
vulnerability without the anger in most clients, its certainly
something I understand on a personal level and sometimes its not enough
to be told your better of without it. However a gently asked 'What
would be the downside of letting go of the anger etc' can result in a
self realisation of the vulnerability felt. That's normal and
there's nothing wrong with this reaction, but true power and strength
does come from understanding we are not vulnerable any more and we have
more resources now. Which include leaving, walking out, phoning the police, we just don't need to be that vulnerable anymore. Sometimes clients have expressed the fear they might forget what it was like, so helping them understand we can learn important lessons and remember what happened without 'feeling it' the physical response to the memory is vital. We also need to understand as therapists that
glibly stating 'that was then, this is now, its over' can be
distressing because our subconcious has NO sense of time and what
happened then feels as if it is happening now in many cases,
particularly somatic flashbacks which are horrendous to experience. I
find I can really get peoples backs up if I say 'that was then, this is
now, its over', but if I say 'that was then, this is now, it feels as
if its happening now, but this is a feeling, a stuck energy and I allow my feelings and energy to
flow and change,' it seems useful in acknowledging this and allowing clients to
make their own choice. Its not up to me to tell them when or how
to do it, I have to remember to honour my clients experience and trust
the process. I particularly appreciate Suzannes comments that its not
up to us to forgive some things but God, or Karma or whatever the
person believes. This is very, very true as how can we ask a tiny baby
to bestow blessings on the person who orally and anally raped him. A
tiny baby can never understand this pain or have words for it. We can
have all the spiritual understanding in the world, but at that point of
pain in the trauma capsule we can do alot of damage by assuming the
baby part feels the same way. Acknowledging that it was wrong,
was abuse, shouldn't have happened, should have been stopped, was
painful, unbearable, undendurable and wrong, is a very good thing to
do, along with tapping, as that child needs his story acknowledged.
Otherwise tapping can become another way to say 'It doesn't matter what
happened' to the part who is still feeling that pain. I also find it helpful to be educated in the affects of trauma and how it is possible for people to abuse and not even know they are doing it and how it is possible for people to feel at times like that baby or vulnerable child even as an adult. Physiological explanations and explanations of how the nervous system works are very important in trauma work especially that of early abuse. Creative, healing from abuse is REALLY hard work even with EFT and I honour your courage and honesty. For most of us, we wouldn't do it unless we had to! Gill
Gillian Wightman "Compassionate EFT - Safe, Gentle, Soothing Freedom" "Above the clouds there are always blue skies" Anxiety Forum Co-moderator EFT CERT-1 AAMET Level 3 practitioner EFT-ADV www.eastneuktherapies.co.ukgillian.myeftwebsite.comAudios for my use of EFT for extreme anxiety and griefFree ebook on anxiety and trauma
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